Hello and welcome to my Burton Deep Thinker review.
In this review, I will take a look at the Deep Thinker as a freeride snowboard.
As per tradition here at SnowboardingProfiles.com I will give the Deep Thinker a score out of 100 (based on several factors) and see how it compares with other freeride snowboards.
NOTE: This review has only been updated to the 2022 model. The 2023 model has changed and we are waiting until we ride this board again before updating.
Whilst the specs didn't change and there's no indication of change I have heard that it's changed quite a bit. And the Free Thinker, which we did test in a 2023 model is quite different to previous models, despite seemingly being unchanged.
Being the Free Thinker's partner in crime, and the fact that reports are that it's different, we believe that the 2023 model is different enough that we can't update this review until we re-test the board.
Overall Rating
Board: Burton Deep Thinker 2021
Price: $599
Style: Freeride
Flex Rating: Medium-Stiff
Flex Feel on Snow: Stiff (8/10)
Rating Score: 81.9/100
Compared to other Men’s Freeride Boards
Out of the 32 men’s freeride snowboards that I rated:
Overview of the Deep Thinker’s Specs
Check out the tables for the Deep Thinker’s specs and available sizes.
Specs
Style: | Freeride |
Price: | $599 |
Ability Level: |  |
Flex: |  |
Feel: |  |
Turn Initiation: | Medium-Fast |
Edge-hold: |  |
Camber Profile: | Directional Hybrid Camber - camber to the tail, then some rocker towards the nose |
Shape: | |
Setback Stance: | Setback 25mm |
Base: | Sintered WFO |
Weight: | Felt a little heavier than normal |
Sizing
LENGTH (cm) | Waist Width (mm) | Rec Rider Weight (lb) | Rec Rider Weight (kg) |
|---|---|---|---|
154 | 248 | 120-180 | 54-82 |
157 | 252 | 150-200 | 68-91 |
160 | 255 | 180-260+ | 82-118+ |
157W | 260 | 150-200 | 68-91 |
160W | 263 | 180-260+ | 82-118+ |
163W | 265 | 180-260+ | 82-118+ |
Who is the Deep Thinker Most Suited To?
The Deep Thinker is best suited to advanced level riders who want a strong carving freeride deck. Something that works great for bombing the groomers and laying down carves, but that also floats well when things get deep.
Not for the beginner and even intermediate riders might struggle a little with this one.
The Deep Thinker in More Detail
O.k. let’s take a more detailed look at what the Deep Thinker is capable of.
Demo Info
Board: Burton Deep Thinker 2021, 160cm (255mm waist width)
Date: March 7, 2020
Conditions: Cloudy but still around 90-95% visibility.
Groomers had a decent layer of soft with mostly a medium firmness under that layer, with some harder spots in patches.
Off groomer soft with some overnight fresh. Not waist deep or anything, but a nice amount.
Wind around 10-15kph (6-9mph). Temperature was -8°C (17.6°F) and with wind chill -11°C (12.2°F).
Bindings angles: +15/-15
Stance width: 560mm (22″)
Stance Setback: Setback 25mm
Width at Inserts: 265mm (10.4") at front insert and 267mm (10.5") at back insert
Rider Height: 6'0"
Rider Weight: 175lbs
Rider Boot Size: US10 Salomon Lo-Fi
Bindings Used: Burton Malavita M
Flex
I couldn't decide if it felt like an 8/10 or a 7.5/10. So somewhere around there. If I was to buy this board I would most likely go with the 157, in which case it would feel a little softer, so then 7.5/10, or possibly between 7/10 and 7.5/10 would be more accurate.
Damp or Chattery?
Quite damp. A good bit up the damp side of the scale.
Smooth or Snappy?
Feels like more of a smooth ride as opposed to a snappy one.
Powder
Felt really good in the shallow powder I had and I would say it would still go really well in deep powder too.
It has some rocker in the nose, has 7mm of taper, 25mm setback on effective edge and a longer nose vs tail. Probably not a super surfy powder feel, but definitely has the specs and feel to be really good in powder.
Carving & Turning
Carving: This is the board's strongest suit, and it's really strong here. Can lay down some big carves on this board.
Turning: You've got to be a bit of energy into turning it, but nothing that's too taxing to turn. Not a super easy turning board, but also not super hard either.
Maneuverability at slow speeds: Not super maneuverable at slower speeds, but better than I was expecting.
Skidded Turns: You can to an extent, but certainly not easy to skid turns on.
Speed
Nice and stable at speed. Feels damp and stable. Might have even scored it a little higher for speed, but I did let go a little on me, when hitting a hard patch at speed. But certainly on good to firm snow, you can really bomb with it.
Uneven Terrain
Decent enough weaving through bumps. Not effortless, you've got to put some energy into it, particularly if it's a really tight spot where you have to take it slow, with short sharp turns, but not terrible in that situation either.
Good in crud. It absorbs chatter pretty well.
Let’s Break up this text with a Video
Jumps
Better than I thought - particularly suited to large straight air.
Pop: You've got to put some effort in to extract it, but once you do, there's decent pop there for sure.
Approach: Nice and stable for those bigger jumps when you need more speed, but less suitable for more technical approaches to side hits and the likes.
Landing: You can stomp a landing on it for sure. Not overly forgiving of errors, but if you stomp it, it feels good.
Side-hits: Not as maneuverable as I would like and pop not easy enough to extract to be great here. And just not forgiving enough when landing is a bit off or you're landing on something uneven.
Small jumps/Big jumps: Big straight air with a good smooth solid landing spot is where this board is best, IMO.
Switch
Felt OK riding switch, but not ideal.
Spins
Getting the spin round is OK, but not super easy. Landing and taking off switch and setting up for a spin or landing one, isn't the best. Not really a spinner.
Jibbing
Fine for anything simple, but not what it's suited to for sure, and not what it's designed for.
Butters
I little easier to butter than I was expecting, but still harder than the average board to butter.
Score Breakdown and Final Verdict
Check out the breakdown of the score in the table below.
RATING | SCORE WEIGHTING | |
|---|---|---|
CARVING | 4.5 | 18/20 |
TURNING | 3.5 | 7/10 |
POWDER | 4.0 | 16/20 |
SPEED | 4.0 | 16/20 |
UNEVEN TERRAIN | 3.0 | 9/15 |
JUMPS | 3.0 | 6/10 |
SWITCH | 2.5 | 2.5/5 |
TOTAL after normalizing | 81.9/100 |
Overall, the Deep Thinker is really fun on a carve and bombing and in powder. Everything you want out of a hard charging freeride board.
Didn't feel amazing in harder spots and not super maneuverable in unever terrain, but overall a nice board for charging on, if you're an advanced rider.
More Info, Current Prices and Where to Buy Online
If you want to learn more about the Deep Thinker, or if you are ready to buy, or if you just want to research prices and availability, check out the links below.
If you want to check out some other freeride snowboard options, or if you want to compare how the Deep Thinker compares to other freeride snowboards, then check out the next link.
Do you recommend Burton Ruler for DT
I know Photon are better but they are more expensive in my country so i have Ruler for better price , so how they fit toghether ?
Tell me opinion for Ruler and for Photon please,
Thanks Nate
Hi Filip
Ideally I would go stiffer than the Ruler for the Deep Thinker. Something at least 6/10 flex and ideally more like 7/10 to 8/10 flex. I found the Ruler closer to 5/10 flex. The Photon is a better flex match (at around 6.5/10 flex), IMO. The Ion would be even better (but super expensive on that one). If you can stretch it to Photon, that’s the way I’d go, but the Ruler are doable for it.
Hi Nate!
Just wondering whether you’ve had a chance to try out the 2023 Burton Deep Thinker as of yet and any initial thoughts?
Thanks
Hi David
Thanks for your message.
We haven’t had a chance to test the 2023 Deep Thinker yet unfortunately. When we make our list of boards to target for testing, we go off specs in the catalogs (can’t test them all in a season unfortunately so have to prioritize!) and the Deep Thinker appeared to have not changed, so we didn’t target it. But by all accounts it sounds like it has changed. But we can’t say from experience how different it is or exactly in what way it changed, though it appears that it’s now more mellow. The Free Thinker, which we did test, is a lot different, despite appearing the same in the specs and is mellower than it used to be (though still more aggressive than it is playful).
But yeah, unfortunately haven’t been able to get on the 2023 yet. Might try to see if we can and if not, we’ll look at testing the 2024 model (assuming it comes back with a 2024 model, which my guess is that it will).
Hey Nate
What bindings size from Burton shoul i get M or L
I am wearing 44 28cm nike for example and 43 1/3 adidas
So its 43-44 depend on sizing
I saw on burton website that i can get M and L too so what is better for me ?
Hi Filip
With your size boots, I would go M. IMO they will fit the bindings the best. I found Burton’s Large too big for my US9.5 Adidas Tactical ADV (which I believe is the 43.3 size). The Nike 44 might fit in there, but I still think it’s going to fit better in the M.
Hope this helps
Thanks a lot
Hi Nate
Im 194 cm tall and 85 kg
Wearing 44 EU 10 USA shoes
What would be ideal DT size for me ?
160cm regular ? I dont want to drag my shoes or smth
Hi Filip
Thanks for your message.
Yeah, I think the 160 is your best bet. Shouldn’t have any issues with boot drag on it with 10s, IMO. I mean if you have really bulky boots and a back binding angle that’s like 0-3 degree AND you’re eurocarving, then it’s possible. But you should be good on the the 160 regular width with 10s.
Hope this helps
I use my bindings at +15 -12 not bellow that
So i will be ok even at eurocarving ?
Hey Filip
IMO you should be OK. Note that I don’t personally eurocarve, so no guarantees. But should be fine, especially if you’re boots aren’t too bulky. Put it this way, if you’ve got 10s that are around 2.5cm longer on the outsole compared to mondo, then you’re looking at around 30.5cm in boot length. The 160 DT is 26.7cm at the back insert. So you’d be looking at around 3.8cm of total boot overhang. At a 15 degree angle that decreases by roughly 10mm (or 1cm) reducing total overhang to 2.8cm – or 1.4cm per edge, assuming perfect boot centering. That’s not a lot of overhang – especially when you take into account toe bevel on your boots that should allow you a pretty big angle to be able to carve from.
Thanks
You are awesome
You’re very welcome Filip. Hope you have an awesome season!
Hey Nate,
Great information and review. I currently own a Burton Custom from 2001. It’s served me very well for that time. I’d consider myself intermediate and above but not an expert. As I’ve gotten older I enjoy better carving and riding the mountain more than the terrain park. I appreciated your review and the fact that the carving was a great component of this board. With that being said, I’m a 165lb, 9 boot and 5’8” height. I was eyeing the 154, but after some of the comments you gave to some other riders, I’m wondering if the 157 wouldn’t be better? What are you thoughts?
Hi Karim
Thanks for your message.
I think the 157 is doable for you. I would put your “standard” length at around 156/157. However, with 9s, this board isn’t what I would call too wide, but it’s borderline – it’s on the wider side for your feet, IMO. So, sizing down to the 154 wouldn’t be a bad idea. Both sizes are in range, but it depends on what you want to optimize more. The 157 will be better in terms of stability at speed, float in powder and for longer, more drawn out big carves. The 154 will have better agility at slower speeds and be the easier ride of the 2. Also better for tricks, but in this case that’s not as relevant.
Note also that the 2023 Deep Thinker, I think, is a bit of a different board. I haven’t updated this review to 2023, because I’ve heard it’s quite different. On paper it’s identical to the 2022 model, which is why we chose not to test the 2023 model, but by all reports this board has become softer and more easy going than past editions. I did re-ride the 2023 Freethinker (which is the more freestyle version of this board) and that, despite being the same on paper, was a very different board. But I would say this board is still a very good carver.
Hope this gives you more to go off for your decision
Hey Nate,
I’m 6 ft 170 lbs with 10.5 boot size. I ride posi posi maxed out on EST. Do you think I’ll be fine with a 157 Deepthinker?
Thanks in advance.
Hey Norm
Thanks for your message.
When you say posi posi maxed out, you mean you have both bindings on as big a positive angle as you can get? I can’t remember off hand what EST bindings can go to, but for example +30/+30 binding angles. Just want to clarify because I don’t hear many going with a positive angle (toes facing front) to that degree, so just to make sure I have that info accurate.
Assuming that’s what you mean, then you should be fine. With that kind of angle on your bindings, you’ll be reducing overhang considerably compared to straigher back binding angles. Even with bulkier 10.5s and doing hard carves, you should be all good, IMO.
Hope this helps
Hi Nate-
love the review, thank you! Im 6-3” 185lbs and advanved intermediate who loves high speed carves. Would the 157W be the right sizing and would my size 13 boots fit?
Thanks!
Eric
Hi Eric
Thanks for your message.
I think the 160W would be better for your specs, particularly given that you like high speed carves. Going there would also give you more leeway in terms of width. I think you can get away with the width, depending on binding angles and the profile of your boots. Might still be a little narrow, even on the 160W if you have bulkier boots and a straight back binding angle. The 160W is around 275mm at the back insert. With 13s, if they’re nice and low profile, you’re looking at around 33cm in length on the outersole, which is around a 5.5cm total overhang, assuming a straight back binding angle. That’s really the very max I would go with and even then it’s pushing it if you like to carve deep. If you ride with some angle on that back binding it gives you a bit more leeway. With a bulkier boot, I think it’d be pushing it. The 157W is that little bit narrower, and even with low profile boots would be pushing it. But I think 160 is a better length for you anyway.
Hope this gives you more to go off for your decision
Hi Nate,
I’m 6’5” 220 lbs size 13. I’m riding the Instigator Flat 160W. I’ve been riding this board for two years now. I like to carve and stable speed. I’m not big into hits and parks. With my board now it’s not very stable through the rough stuff in the middle of the day when I’m trying to get some speed. Would this board be good for me in a 160W?
Hi Tony
Thanks for your message.
The Deep Thinker would definitely give you a lot more stability at speed. It’s a lot more board than the Instigator – it’s camber and it’s a lot stiffer. If you feel like you’re still an intermediate rider, particularly if you feel you’re still low intermediate, then it’s going to be a big step up from your current board. You could give it a go – and in that case, I would go 160W. If you feel like you’re at a more advanced level, then I would go to the 163W.
Hope this helps with your decision
Hey Nate,
I want to start by saying that I really appreciate the forum that you’ve created here. The concise, thorough information that you’ve laid out for the public is fantastic.
Here comes the part where I ask for some advice however… 😛
I’m a relatively beginner/intermediate snowboarder. This was my first season, and I have about 6 days total Snowboarded. Somehow, day 2 I was doing double black’s at snowbird albeit not well (take this for what it’s worth).
I’m 5’5″, weigh ~160 lbs, and my boot size is a 7 (small bindings).
I recently began purchasing my gear, and I currently have the Burton Cartel X EST’s, Burton Photon boots, and recently purchased a Burton Deep Thinker 154.
The 154 was available at a local shop for 20% off so I decided to capitalize. I’m a little worried though that this board may be too advanced for me. I feel like the board generally fits the description of the riding I’d like to do: (all mountain leaning towards off-piste, good carving, good for powder days).
Do you think this purchase was a mistake? What other boards would you recommend? I believe I am able to get my hands on a Burton Custom Flying V in 150 for about the same price, but I’d like to keep this board if possible.
Best,
Carlos M.
Hi Carlos
Thanks for your message.
I think the boot and bindings match the board well – but the setup as a whole isn’t one I’d recommend for 6 days experience. The problem with going with this kind of setup before you’re ready for it, is that it can lead to crude technique and can affect your confidence – and also not be that enjoyable to ride, so can even make you start to dislike riding altogether (the last thing you want!). So yeah, unfortunately this isn’t a setup I would recommend, yet.
The Custom Flying V 150 would be a much better option. Still not a pure beginner board, but given that it sounds like your progressing quickly – and in the 150 size – I think this would be a much better option.
Size-wise, I think 154 would be a good size for that board, when you’re more advanced, so if you had the means to keep it and use it later when you’re more advanced you could. I think the 150 for the Custom Flying V would be a good beginner length for you. I would say around 153-155 is a good all-mountain length for your specs at a more advanced level and 150-152 is the optimal range, IMO, as a beginner.
Some other options below, if you were interested. The first list is complete beginner boards. The second list is more beginner bordering on intermediate, which it sounds like might be where you’re at. But if you wanted to go Custom Flying V in 150, I think that would work too. But I would be very hesitant on the Deep Thinker at this stage.
>>My Top 15 Men’s Snowboards for Beginners
>>Top 10 Intermediate Snowboards
Hope this helps
I have the 2019/2020 163W version of this and I love it out here in WA.
I clock in at 240lbs/6’ and have been riding for 20+ years. Usually I ride twins but when I moved from CO to WA I wanted something different for the really heavy mushy snow here that wouldn’t squirm so much.
Not sure if it’s my weight or how I ride but this made certain runs way more fun in terms of control. You can break it loose but like the review says keep it pointed straight for maximum joy.
Low to mid-speed spins are fun but I agree with the review, you basically land on a knife edge and unlike my Process, which is super forgiving, the Deep Thinker will punish you if your technique isn’t dialed in.
Great review and super fun to hear what others think of the ride!
Hey Shawn
Thanks for your message and your insights, much appreciated.
Hi Nate,
Thanks for this review. It was super helpful. I’m 5’5” and 155 lbs. I wear 8.5 Burton boots. For the longest time I’ve ridden a 156 wide camber because I was just misinformed when I started out 15 years ago. My jam is more going fast and having a good amount of control at fast speeds.
Would you think a 154 would be ok, given all the info above? Thanks!
Hi Peter
Thanks for your message.
I think 154 is spot on for you for your specs and how you describe your riding, for this board. And I think you’ll really appreciate the width on it too, compared to your wide. Of course after 15 years of riding one board, it will take an adjustment period, but when you do, I think you’ll really appreciate it. And for what you describe I think the board is a good choice too.
Hope this helps
Hi Nate,
I’m super impressed with your knowledge and patience answering so many peoples questions! I’m an advanced all mountain rider- 170 lbs with a 10.5 boot and have been riding a salomon fastback 163 since about 2002. Last year I decided to finally get a new board and went with the deep thinker 157 after demoing several. I think I probably should have gotten a wide since a couple of times in hard fast turns the heels/toes of my boots hit and caused me to lose my edge… but I bought the board- still unused/wrapped just so I could apply the demo cost to. I was going to continue using my old salomon bindings but they’ve seen better days and I would need to get new pucks to fit the burton channel system so I’m planning on getting new bindings. Torn between getting genesis EST but reluctant to have bindings that’ll only work for burton boards. I’m not super convinced that the increased board feel will be worth the trade off but am also a little worried that using non EST bindings with only two bolts close together underfoot won’t be secure enough. What are your thoughts? If EST which burton bindings would you suggest? If non EST which bindings would you recommend? Thank you in advance for your input!
Hi Ryan
Thanks for your message.
Yeah, definitely right on that cuff with 10.5s in terms of going wide or not. Sometimes yeah, sometimes no. In this case, given that you got boot drag, probably the 157W makes more sense.
In terms of bindings for the Deep Thinker, I don’t think you need to go EST necessarily. I think as far as Burton bindings go, EST bindings do work better on the channel than Re:flex, but it’s not a deal breaker, IMO. I have never felt unsecure on the Channel with Burton Re:Flex bindings. I haven’t put other bindings on Burton boards before, but I’ve never heard of any issues in terms of not being secure.
If you go EST, I would go Custom X for the Deep Thinker. The Genesis would be OK, but ideally you’d want something stiffer for that board, IMO.
If you don’t go EST, then there are a lot of options from Burton and other brands. I would check out the following:
>>Top 5 All-Mountain-Freeride Bindings
>>Top 5 Freeride Bindings
Hope this helps
Hey, Im 6.1 155 lb intermediate rider. Do you think 157 would be too large?
Hi Brennen
Thanks for your message.
As a freeride board – and assuming you’re looking for good float in powder and good stability at speed and that kind of thing, I think the 157 is a good size for your specs.
Hope this helps
Hey Nate,
Im 5’10 and size 9.5 Boot – do you suggest going with a 157, 157W, or 160?
Hi James
Can you please let me know your weight. Weight is more important for length sizing than height. With a 9.5 boot, I wouldn’t go wide, but in terms of the length, it will really depend on your weight. Since you’re looking at this board, I assume you’re a relatively advanced rider and want to be able to ride fast, carve etc. But if you can also let me know a little about how you like to ride, as that also comes into sizing, IMO.
Hi Nate,
Not sure if my last message went through. I’m an intermediate-advanced all mountain freestyle rider. I want to be able to play around with the board and take it on more uneven terrain and powder, but also ride fast, carve. I would love to know if this works for my style of riding.
I’m 175 lbs
Hi James
Size-wise, I think the 157 is probably the best way to go for this board.
In terms of whether it’s suitable or not. For everything you’re describing there it’s suitable for that, if you’re happy with a stiffer deck. Everything except when you say all-mountain freestyle. Do you ride any park? Or do sidehits, spins, 180s, butters or other tricks around the mountain? If you are doing freestyle stuff, then there are more suitable options than this, but if not, then this could work for sure.
I am an intermediate rider, but I’ve had the same board for the last 5 years and I need a new one. I was thinking of getting the Deep thinker to have at college with me where I will be snowboarding in the next upcoming years. Do you think an intermediate could handle this board?
Hi Jack
Thanks for your message.
IMO not a great board for an intermediate. If you’re a high level intermediate and quite athletic and/or went with a size that’s a little shorter than what you usually would, then I think you’d get away with it, assuming you like to ride fast, powder etc and not much in terms of freestyle or anything too tight, like trees too much. Then I think it’s doable. But a lot of ifs to make it doable, IMO.
Hope this helps
Hey!
Your reviews are awesome and super helpful.
Im ordering a deep thinker very soon. Im 195lbs , 5’11 and size 11 boot.
Do you think I should go 157W on this? I fall right in between sizes and not sure which way to go.
Hi Sam
Thanks for your message.
I don’t think the 157W would be wrong, but I would be leaning towards 160 or 160W for your specs.
The 160 could be wide enough in the right circumstances. If you have low profile boots and ride with binding angles like +15/-15 or similar, then I think you could potentially sneak onto the 160. In all other scenarios, I would be looking at the 160W.
But like I said the 157W isn’t wrong. It would be a very good width for you, IMO. It’s downsizing a little bit, but if you prefer something a little shorter, then it is a possibility. Just note that it would likely feel a little softer than how I felt the board – not soft or anything, but maybe more like a 7/10, at a guess, than an 8/10. 157W would be more maneuverable at slower speeds but less stable at higher speeds versus the 160 or 160W – and not be as good in powder as the longer options.
Hope this helps with your decision
Does the deep thinker feel and ride stiffer than the custom and flight attendant?
Hi Jay
Thanks for your message.
Yeah it felt and rode stiffer than the Custom and Flight Attendant to me. But not quite as stiff as the Custom X or Straight Chuter.
Odd about the straight chuter. It’s not rated on the Burton site as being that stiff or aggressive.
Thanks for the info, most likely made my decision based on this.
Hi Jay
Yeah strange that they have it listed as a happy medium. Not sure if that’s an error? Just went back over my notes and definitely confirmed that I found it stiffer than the Deep Thinker (which I rode the same day). And the Burton rep even described the Straight Chuter as the freeride Custom X. And I’ve read other reviews saying they found it really stiff. So yeah thinking it’s probably a typo on their website.
Hi Nate,
First of all thanks for your feeback about Burton Deepthinker 21.
Regarding your comment in Flex i’m 155lbs and 5’81 do you suggest 154cm or 157?
I also reading a comparative between Deep thinker and Skeleton key.
Skeleton key is more lighter than Deep thinker/
Did you have the feeling of “heavy board”?
Thanks in advance
Matthieu
Hi Matthieu
Thanks for your message.
For your specs, I would go 154 for sure.
The Deep Thinker felt just a little heavier than normal to me, overall. It’s not a super heavy board by any means, but a little heavier than normal, from my feel and a little heavier than the Skeleton Key from my feel. I didn’t weigh either of these boards, so this is just how they felt to me to ride. Being stiffer can make a board feel heavier too sometimes, so with the Deep Thinker being stiffer than the Skeleton Key, that will influence that too.
Hope this helps